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Nightwalker's Realm Hello mortal... Take everything here with a grain of salt, it's just me ranting. The opinions expressed on this site are solely the author's, and not representative of any individual, company, corporation, government, head of state, deity, pantheon, or anyone or anything else I may have missed. Oh yeah, a few simple rules. 1.Don't feed the animals. 2.Read at your own risk. 3.If anything offends you, quit reading and don't come back. Dete ike! Kono shirinukeme! P R O F I L E
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12/03/2004 Wrong to Love? By RICHARD N. OSTLING, AP Religion Writer PUGHTOWN, Pa. - A jury made up of United Methodist Church clergy convicted a lesbian minister Thursday of violating church law by openly living with her partner in a committed relationship. The Rev. Irene Elizabeth Stroud could be defrocked as a result of the ruling, which came on the second day of her church trial. The same 13-member jury was set to meet Thursday afternoon to decide her penalty. Methodist law bars "self-avowed, practicing homosexuals" from ministry. Nine votes were necessary for a conviction and the jury voted 12-1 to find Stroud guilty. The last time the 8.3 million-member denomination convicted an openly gay cleric was in 1987, when a New Hampshire church court defrocked the Rev. Rose Mary Denman. Last March, a Methodist court in Washington state acquitted the Rev. Karen Dammann, who lives with a same-sex partner, citing an ambiguity in church law that the Methodist supreme court has since eliminated. Before the jury returned, Stroud, 34, told reporters that whatever the verdict, "this case has shown how divided we are" over the role of gays in the church. She had expected to be convicted. Stroud, associate pastor at Philadelphia's First United Methodist Church of Germantown, set the case in motion last year when she announced to her bishop and congregation that she was living in a committed relationship with her partner, Chris Paige. At her trial, Stroud's defense was dealt a blow when the presiding judge Joseph Yeakel, the retired bishop of Washington, D.C., excluded expert testimony from six defense witnesses who believe the church's gay clergy ban violates its own legal principles. The senior pastor of Stroud's church, the Rev. Alfred Day III, attempted to raise a similar issue when he took the stand, saying "I believe that even the testimony of Scripture is far from clear on this subject." "We have more muddle than clarity," he said. But the prosecuting attorney, the Rev. Thomas Hall of Exton, Pa., asked Yeakel to strike Day's statement and the judge instructed the jury that "constitutional issues are not before this court." Stroud's defense counsel, the Rev. J. Dennis Williams, said in closing arguments that "the heart of the issue is whether all United Methodists, regardless of status, are to be afforded equal rights and equal opportunities." "I only wish you could hear the full testimony we wished to present," Williams said. But Hall told jurors they had a duty to "hold a good pastor accountable to the standard with which we all live" under the Methodist Book of Discipline. The basic facts in the case were never in dispute, since Stroud had declared she was gay. The only two defense witnesses to be called were Day and the senior pastor who supervised her in Westchester, Pa. Both lavishly praised her performance in preaching, teaching and pastoral work. Hall agreed with that assessment. Stroud's supportive Philadelphia congregation has already agreed that she can continue doing her work as a lay employee without clergy status. However, she will be unable to celebrate baptism or Communion. It's so sad that in this day and age to see something like this happening. Such narrow ways of thinking is one of the major reasons why I don't bind myself to any religion. What is so wrong about loving someone and being loved in return? Just because they are of the same sex does not mean that they should not find happiness. The whole problem I think is the archaic notion that SEX is a bad and dirty thing that should only be practiced by married couples to produce offspring. Any pleasure derived from the act is considered sinful in some circles and doubly sinful if said act is carried out with the member of the same sex. I am a straight healthy male and some of the nicest people I know are gay. Not my cup of tea but hey I've always believed in the freedom of choice. Unforturnately society is still living in the stone age for the most part. People who do not conform to social norms are frowned upon....in some places being gay is tantamount to asking for a death sentance. Such a sad state of affairs much of it brought on by religion or what I would like to call "mortal interpretation of God's will." God, if there is a god should be a little more proactive with the lightning bolts don't you think? After all we are mortal and bound by mortal fallacies in interpretationg what really is God's will ( some people swear it's burgers and fries every Wednesday night ). Speaking in general terms it's fine but with the story above I cant help but notice the fact that the lady knew what she was getting into. She knew the law and she went ahead and broke it thus the end result. Now, this is where things get a little murky. The lady could have easily quit the church and saved herself the heartache of being tried in court for the simple crime of being in love. Now if she were to do that and denounce her god in the name of love what kind of message does that send? So she stuck in there and got punished for it. Like I said murky. Overall there is no perfect solution to the matter until people make a concious effort to change. I havent asked this from anyone reading this site yet but I would like comments on this. Please feel free to leave your opinions but please let's make it constructive opinions. My thoughts on religion: it offends me more than homosexuality and the people who are sad enough to need imaginary comforts and are willing to put up with shit when the institution of faith craps on them deserves it  Anti-poet, at
2:23 PM Anti-poet, at
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